A PREGNANT WOMAN HAS BEEN
SHOT AND KILLED BY NEPALESE WHO WERE RESPONDING TO A WELLNESS
CALL. HER NAME WAS REN… DEVON AVIS, SHE WAS 23 YEARS OLD AND
FIVE MONTHS PREGNANT, SINGLE MOTHER OF 3. SHE WAS ALSO A
NATIVE AMERICAN AND SHE HAD A HISTORY OF MENTAL ILLNESS AND
DEPRESSION. IT WAS BECAUSE OF THIS THAT SHE WAS ACTUALLY
REPORTED TO HAVE BEEN, AUTHORITIES WERE CALLED TO HER
PLACE. A RELATIVE OF DAVIS CALLED THE SUREST APARTMENT ON
FRIDAY AFTER RECEIVING AN ALARMING TEXT FROM THE MOTHER OF
3. POLICE ARE GOOD SHOW THE OFFICERS RESPONDING TO A CALL
ABOUT A POTENTIAL SUICIDE ENCOUNTERED A WOMAN WITH A
HANDGUN AND TWO SMALL CHILDREN IN THE HOUSE WHEN THEY ARRIVED
AT 630 IN THE EVENING. A BUNCH OF THE DETAILS ARE STILL BEING
RECOVERED BY HER FRIENDS AND FAMILY DIDN’T KNOW THE SHE HAD A
HANDGUN. THEY KNEW SHE HAD A HUNTING KNIFE, BUT MUCH OF THAT
IS STILL YET TO BE DETERMINED THAT THE GOOD NEWS IS THAT HER
KIDS ARE, BOTH OF THEM ARE SAFE. SEATTLE LAWYER RYAN DRAFT COUGH
TOLD THE TIMESTHAT UNFORTUNATELY THESE SCENARIOS ARE ALL TOO
COMMON WHEN POLICE INTERACT WAS PEOPLE STRUGGLING WITH
MENTAL ILLNESS. JUST LAST WEEK WE WERE PORTED ON
POLICE REPORTING TO A SCENE OF A WELLNESS CALL AND SHOTS
WERE FIRED AND INDEED KILLING THAT PERSON. THE SCHIZOPHRENIC LADY I
THINK. AN ELDERLY WOMAN. THIS IS A REPEAT STORY
UNFORTUNATELY THAT WE HAVE COVERED ON THIS NUMBER BEFORE. CENK UYGUR ARE YOU SURPRISED BY
HEARING ABOUT THIS AGAIN? I AM REALLY STARTING TO WORRY
THAT PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO CALL THE COPS AND THEY NEED THEM
BECAUSE FOR UNDERSTANDABLE REASONS, BECAUSE WE HAVE TOLD
ALL THE COPS THAT THERE IS ANY THREAT ALL, SHE THEM. IF YOU
GET CALLED IN BECAUSE SOMEONE MIGHT BE A THREAT TO THEMSELVES
AND THEY HAVE SOME SORT OF WEAPON, THE Ä66 FROM LAST WEEK
HAD A BAT. ORIGINALLY SHE HAD A KNIFE AND SHE PUT IT DOWN. SHE’S LIKE THEY MIGHT SWING THE BAT, THEY SHOT HER AND KILLED
HER. IN THIS CASE, SHE HAD A GUN, OR AT LEAST THAT’S WHAT THE
POLICE ARE SAYING RIGHT NOW. OKAY, I UNDERSTAND THAT MEANT
MAKES IT A MUCH MORE DANGEROUS SITUATION. LAST WEEK WE TALKED
ABOUT YOU MAY BE ABLE TO TASE A PERSON WITH A BAT, OR AVOID
GETTING HIT BY A 66-YEAR-OLD THOUGHT YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO
ABSORB THE BLOW. GUN IS A DIFFERENT SITUATION. I
UNDERSTAND THAT BUT AT THE SAME TIME WHEN THEY CALL YOU TO HELP
THE PERSON, YOU SHOULD REALLY GO OUT OF YOUR WAY TO TRY TO HELP
THEM. YOU CAN TAKE EXTRAORDINARY RISK WITH YOUR
LIFE, AND I OFTEN CRITICIZE COPS FOR TAKING NO RISK. IN THIS
CASE IN A REAL RISK THAT WE HAD A GUN. IN THAT NARRATIVE THERE WERE
ALSO CHILDREN AROUND AND I THINK THEY ARE TRYING TO SAY THAT SHE
COULD’VE BEEN A THREAT TO THE CHILDREN. IF THERE WAS A
HANDGUN AND. FOR SHOOTING WITHIN THE
APARTMENT IS ALSO A THREAT TO THE CHILDREN. ABSOLUTELY. SOME POLICE DEPARTMENTS DO
THIS RIGHT THAT WE TALKED ABOUT IT BEFORE. APPARENTLY SEATTLE
IS ON ITS PATH TO DOING IT RIGHT BUT THERE IS A LOT OF DIFFERENT
POLICE DEPARTMENTS WITHIN THE STATE OF WASHINGTON. SAN
ANTONIO DOES IT RIGHT. THEY TRAIN THEIR COPS TO BE AWARE OF
MENTAL ILLNESSES AND HOW YOU DE-ESCALATE BUT UNFORTUNATELY, A
LOT OF THE POLICE DEPARTMENT ACROSS THE COUNTRY HAVEN’T DONE
THAT YET AND IT IS UNBELIEVABLE NEGLIGENCE ON THEIR PART NOT TO
DO IT. THE NUMBER ONE CATEGORY OF PEOPLE OUTSIDE OF
AFRICAN-AMERICANS TO BE SHOT WHILE THEY ARE UNARMED ARE
PEOPLE WITH MITTEN IT MENTAL ILLNESS ISSUES. WITHIN THE
MIDDLE OF THE COUNTRY WERE THERE LESS AFRICAN-AMERICANS, THE
NUMBER ONE CATEGORY IS PEOPLE WITH MENTAL ISSUES BECAUSE COPS
COME IN, EVERYTHING IS A THREAT. HE IS ACTING ERRATICALLY, SHOE
HIM. WHAT I STARTED WITH, WHICH IS THAT THIS KEEPS HAPPENING, WE
ARE NOT MAKING IT UP THAT WE ARE REPORTING IT THAT KEEPS
HAPPENING OVER AND OVER, THEN YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE ANOTHER
PROBLEM WHICH IS I HAVE A PERSON ACTING WITH SIGNIFICANT
ISSUES HERE, I’M WORRIED THEY’RE GOING TO HURT THEMSELVES
THAT I CAN CALL THE COPS BECAUSE THE CAPSULE KILL THEM. THEN YOU HAVE THAT SET OF
PROBLEMS TO DEAL WITH THAT. THE ONE THING I WANTED TO SAY
IS THIS IS NOT NECESSARILY NEW. HAVE YOU HEARD OF THE TERM
SUICIDE BY COP? THAT’S A LITTLE DIFFERENT. BY THE WAY, ONE OF THE STORIES WE COVERED THE GUY WAS
SAYING TO THE COPS KILL ME. I HATE MY LIFE. SUICIDE BY COP DOESN’T
NECESSARILY MEAN KILL ME. THAT I HAVE TO SAY THAT BUT THEY
WILL USUALLY POINT A GUN IN THEIR DIRECTION KNOWING FULL
WELL THAT THE POLICE OFFICERS WILL RESPOND AND SHOOT
AND KILL THEM. THAT’S RIGHT, BUT I VIEW THAT
TO BE A SEPARATE CATEGORY. IN THIS CASE AND THE 66 ROLLED
WOMAN FROM LAST WEEK, THERE WERE NO FACTS LEADING US TO BELIEVE
THAT IT WAS A SUICIDE BY COP. THEY DIDN’T SAY ANYTHING
ALONG THOSE LINES. THEY WERE ACTING ERRATICALLY,
BUT THEY DIDN’T SEEM TO WANT TO DIE AND THAT IS WHY
THEIR FAMILY MEMBERS CALLED TO TRY TO SAVE THEM. ESPECIALLY IN THE CASE OF THE
66 ROLLED SWINGING A BAT. IT DOESN’T CALL FOR THAT. WHAT I
WAS TRYING TO SAY IS THIS IS IN OUR CULTURE. PEOPLE ARE AWARE
THAT POLICE OFFICERS WILL SHOOT YOU ON SITE, OTHERWISE NO ONE
WOULD THINK TO EVEN COME UP WITH SOMETHING LIKE SUICIDE BY COP. WHAT I’M SAYING IS IT IS SO PERVASIVE THAT IT HAPPENS SO
FREQUENTLY THAT IT IS A PART OF OUR CULTURE AND IT HAS BEEN A
PART OF OUR CULTURE FOR A WHILE. IT’S MAYBE THE SILVER LINING IN
THIS INSTANCE IS THAT BECAUSE OF THE MORE AWARENESS AROUND IT, WE
NOW SEE THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE PROBING THESE
DEPARTMENTS AND THEN COMING OUT WITH REALLY CONCLUSIVE RESULTS,
REALLY HORRIFIC DISPROPORTIONATE RACISM LIKE IN THE CASE OF
BALTIMORE POLICE DEPARTMENT AND HOPEFULLY WE WILL BE ABLE TO
REHABILITATE SOME OF THESE POLICE DEPARTMENT, CHANGE THE
STRUCTURE, AND LESS PEOPLE WILL DIE AT THE HANDS OF POLICE
OFFICERS. I THOUGHT YOU BROUGHT UP A
REALLY GOOD POINT ABOUT HOW SEATTLE POLICE HAS GONE TO
GREAT LENGTHS TO TRAIN THEIR POLICE FORCE IN DE-ESCALATION. THIS WAS REALLY INTERESTING
TO SEE THAT EVEN OF THE SEATTLE POLICE ARE BEING
TRAINED AND TECHNIQUES OF DE-ESCALATION, HOPEFULLY WE WILL
SEE THAT AS A POSITIVE THAT INDEED IT IS NOT PERVASIVE
ENOUGH TO SPREAD TO THE REST OF THE STATE THAT WHEN YOU
THINK THAT IS STILL A STRUGGLE? WE’RE SEEING IN METROPOLITAN
AREAS BUT A MORE RURAL AREAS, THIS TOOK PLACE ON TRIBAL
LANDS, TECHNIQUES OF THE ESCALATIONS ARE NOT EVEN THE
CONVERSATION YET. WHAT IS THE HOLD UP? I KNOW THAT SOME PEOPLE WILL
SAY THEY ARE MORE LIKELY TO DO ESCALATION I THINK THERE’S SOME
EVIDENCE, BUT I THINK THE POLICE UNIONS OFTEN GO EITHER WAY TO
DEFEND COPS RIGHT AROUND I GET IT, THEY ARE UNION. BUT IT
MAKES THEM SUPER RESISTANT TO CHANGE. IN THEIR MINDS THEY
FEEL BESIEGED. THERE LIKE NO WAY, WE’RE NOT DOING ANYTHING
WRONG AND WE HAVE TO PROTECT OURSELVES. CONTENT FOR A
SECOND, LET’S FIGURE OUT HOW WE CAN ALL DO THIS TOGETHER. YOU
RUN INTO THE BRICK WALL OF OLD SCHOOL THINKING WHICH IS MY
WHERE THE HIGHWAY. I’M NEVER GOING TO CHANGE ANYTHING. IT IS
GETTING PEOPLE KILLED.